Topic: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

I've investigated a few PHP frameworks out there including: Cake PHP, Zend and Drupal.  I wanted to ping the community here and see if anyone has any recommendations, warnings or insights into using a PHP framework and which one you would really recommend.

Thanks!

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

cwpollock: The digerati team at LifeChurch.tv are switching to the CodeIgniter framework. Here's a blog post about it. You might get some insight from that post and from the comments. I'm looking into using this for one of my next projects.

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

Well...I guess everybody can figure out what my recommendation would be. smile CodeIgniter!!

I'm also using the Zend Framework (ZF) for an application at work. It has a little bit more of a learning curve (IMO) and seems to be designed more for people looking to build larger/enterprise applications (though it can be used for smaller ones as well no doubt). What I like about it, is that you can use individual components should you only need to use certain things.

If you're just starting out with a PHP and PHP frameworks in general, I would recommend CodeIgniter.

Note: ZF requires you're server to be running PHP 5.1.4 or later, while CI, can run with both PHP 4 and 5.

Hope that helps. If you need a little more info on either, then let me know.

@Andy Knight: That's awesome that Lifechurch.tv is using CI. w00t! Score one for CI!

Exercise your faith!

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

The only PHP framework that I've used is CodeIgniter, back when I was working on a new version of my personal site's CMS, and I really liked it. The learning curve wasn't bad at all (this coming from someone who is not a power programmer by any means), and the documentation and training materials were very helpful.

I feel a nostalgia for an age yet to come...

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

Regarding the discussion around CodeIgniter, I just wanted to say that Digital Web published my CI book review...

http://www.digital-web.com/articles/cod … velopment/

Give me liturgy or give me death.

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

I have no insights to offer, just a flag to wave. Frog CMS, a PHP-implementation of the RoR Radiant CMS, is built around a lightweight PHP framework called, err, Framework (a.k.a. "Green Framework"). Some users in the community's forum seem excited by it; maybe it's worth a look?

Last edited by DjR (2008-12-16 09:11:43)

David Reimer  //  ↪ "If you know the resurrection is coming, it's impossible to be in utter darkness." — Tim Keller ↩

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

If you have php Knowledge then Drupal rocks, though it is not a framework, but rather a full CMS. I can put a drupal site together in a few hours because it is so easy to use once you get the hang of it.. The Lifechurch.tv crew actually switched their frame work over to Kohana Which is based on Ci but is more community driven. It really just depends on what you want to take the time to sit down with and learn.

Adam A. Gregory || Project Lead || TheOpenSourceChurch.org

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

That's funny, lifechurch.tv made their own cms a few months ago, when EE 2.0, made on code igniter  is coming out this summer... so much work for ellislab to come out with something so much better, just a short while later. that sucks.

go with code igniter... just do it, you'll be glad you did.

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

The website I work for is actually in the process of switching over to Kohana and let me tell you, it's a beautiful thing! Having started my coding career in Eiffel, I'm a big fan of MVC (which Kohana implements). All in all 'd go with Kohana just from what I've seen of it. But I'm not going to say there aren't better options. I agree with ArcaneAdam, it really depends on what you want to take the time for.

Feel free to check out... My Blog or My Website

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

Telltale wrote:

The website I work for is actually in the process of switching over to Kohana and let me tell you, it's a beautiful thing! Having started my coding career in Eiffel, I'm a big fan of MVC (which Kohana implements). All in all 'd go with Kohana just from what I've seen of it. But I'm not going to say there aren't better options. I agree with ArcaneAdam, it really depends on what you want to take the time for.

I've been using Code Igniter for about 10 months now and I really like it.  Kohana is actaully a fork of CI (or so I've been told).  Kohana has been recommended to me, but right now I like the broader based community support of CI.

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

Yeah, I feel you on the broader support community. Compared to PHP, Eiffel has slim pickings when it comes to technical help, or any sort of teaching/learning community. Thank the Lord I got switched over to PHP... lol

I'm gonna look into code igniter now, you've piqued my interest.

Feel free to check out... My Blog or My Website

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

We just had this discussion on the PHP mailing list (php-general@lists.php.net), anyone else here a participant on that list?

At the end of the discussion, this is what I got:
1. What am I hoping to gain from a framework? At best, I'll get consistency of code from me to the next developer who works on this project.
2. There aren't really any short term gains in development cycle times. Since I don't presently use a framework, I'll have to add 'learning the framework' to my already busy schedule for the project I use one on.
3. Even the best frameworks are an order of magnitude slower (server performance wise) than PHP/templates...though the performance gap probably converges the more complex the application gets
4. None of the frameworks are perfect, all have their weaknesses...making choosing one difficult
5. The overhead of learning a framework (for me anyway) would limit me to choosing one...I just don't have the time or mental agility to work with 2 different approaches to PHP

I decided to forgo the framework and just focus on better discipline in my code instead (better spec, better documentation, OOP design where practical)

I'd love to continue that discussion here if you guys are up for it.

It looks to me like the real value in any framework is integrating a TEAM of programmers/developers and giving them all a common way to work. The value seems pretty lost on the lone contractor who is a one man band (like myself).

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

Let me prefix what I'm about to say with the fact I'm not an uber PHP programmer. I'm more of a designer + JavaScript enthusiast. I just know enough about PHP to have cobbled together Godbit via open source tools. smile

That said, if I had to choose a framework, it'd probably be CodeIgniter. With the upcoming, eventual release of ExpressionEngine 2.0, the CMS will run on the CI codebase. So, for me, that'd be a good way to extend an already great system. Additionally, LifeChurch.tv now runs on Kohana, which began its life as a fork from CI. I consider LC.tv to be have some of the best thought leaders in web ministry.

I've also heard good things about CakePHP, but at a glance, CI's documentation seems more thorough. Again, since I'm not PHP expert, well written instructions are very important to me. Jonathan Snook wrote a well balanced article awhile back...

http://snook.ca/archives/php/codeigniter_vs_cakephp/

Give me liturgy or give me death.

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

Nathan Smith wrote:

That said, if I had to choose a framework, it'd probably be CodeIgniter. With the upcoming, eventual release of ExpressionEngine 2.0, the CMS will run on the CI codebase. So, for me, that'd be a good way to extend an already great system. Additionally, LifeChurch.tv now runs on Kohana, which began its life as a fork from CI. I consider LC.tv to be have some of the best thought leaders in web ministry.

Ditto. It would be CI or Kohana for me. I use a self built framework that uses MVC mainly out of the desire to not want to learn something new and be tied to the development cycle of someone else. But after looking at Kohana, I am sold. And if it's good enough for Rasmus.. I'm sold twice.

Most non-cakePHP users will say they don't use it because it's heavy and bloated (myself included), but I think the reality is that for MOST web projects we will never have the need to worry about bloat at the scale we are developing for. I'd say spend a few hours with each one and see what best fits in with your style. for me it was CI/Kohana.

Last edited by tank (2009-01-19 07:43:26)

I dream with an XML intereface

Re: PHP Frameworks - Recommendations? Warnings? Insights?

also... here are some benchmarks:
http://www.avnetlabs.com/php/php-framew … benchmarks

I dream with an XML intereface