Topic: ASP.NET Help

Although I think www.asp.net/forums is probably the best place to go for really tought ASP.NET questions, I've been working with ASP.NET for a fews years now and I would love to help fellow Christian web developers with any questions that come up.

Re: ASP.NET Help

Well I am your man.  I have been doing ASP.NET since it came out back in 2002, and would more than happy to answer your questions.

What questions do you have?

Re: ASP.NET Help

Joshua - Looks like John was offering advice as well.  Looks like we have a good .NET knowledge base here smile

Re: ASP.NET Help

For the record, I cannot help with ASP.NET. Just to be clear.

Re: ASP.NET Help

Awesome guys! Glad we have you two ASP .NET gurus around. I have used ASP a little at work but I really don't know it all that well. How different is ASP .NET from just regular ASP?

Exercise your faith!

Re: ASP.NET Help

The two are very different.  There isn't really a way to upgrade from ASP to ASP.NET.  It's more of a redesign.  ASP.NET pre-compiles most of your code and is no longer an interpreted scripting language.  Although it still has the Request and Response objects, they are much more peripheral as ASP.NET is actually event-driven (ie a button has a click event). 

VBScript was essentially eliminated and replaced with VB.NET which is fully object-oriented and considered a 1rst class language except by some C# purists.  You can do anything with it you would with C# - almost, there are at least a couple unresolved bugs in the VB compiler.

Re: ASP.NET Help

Thanks whodurun4. Would you say that ASP.NET is easy to learn?

Exercise your faith!

Re: ASP.NET Help

It depends.  I primarily taught myself and was just experienced enough in VB 6.0  and VBA (Visual Basic for Applications - Access, etc.) to be dangerous.  Now, I'm the technical lead at my day job.

I think the key is understanding object oriented design concepts such as the difference between a type or class and an object or an instance.  If you understand that, it's the biggest step.  The next most difficult would be understanding ADO.NET.  It has a disconnected structure.  Your data objects can actually store a miniature "version" of the database.  It is probably most advantagous when used with web services.

VB.NET is quite productive and, hopefully, the unaddressed bugs in the compiler have been fixed in v2.0.  C# will have more common syntax if you're familiar with Java.  I can't speak for other languages.

Re: ASP.NET Help

Hmm...interesting. I'm still trying to get used to the whole object oriented programming approach with Java. Apparently I'm a bit of a slow learner when it comes to that. hehe.

Exercise your faith!

Re: ASP.NET Help

Don't worry, you're not alone.  It took me a long time.  2 tips / thoughts:

1.  Almost everything is a template until you call its constructor an assign it to a variable unless it is a static method
2.  Never read Microsoft's official documentation - it makes you go blind

I spent too much time doing the second.  I think devx.com has some good tutorials.  Microsoft has/had free tutorials, but I think you had to sign up by last Friday.

Re: ASP.NET Help

Well, glad to see I'm not the only ASP/.NET guy lurking around in here!

Just wanted to backup what whodurun4 said about learning .net.  If you have a good grasp of OOP then .net will not be a problem.  You can use several different languages, including VB, C#, C++, and a sort-of Microsoft version of Java, so language compatability is not an issue.  But, .net is a tool, and like all tools, it is not always appropriate and as you get into the .net platform you'll begin to be able to recognize those times.  I absolutely love it for database-heavy sites.  The way it uses datasets and connectivity is, to my mind, miles ahead of Recordsets in asp.

Gene

...but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.  Joshua 24:15

Re: ASP.NET Help

This is my first post and I must say I'm very excited about the concept of this site, and am looking forward to nosing around.

I'm a front-end/usability/graphic designer for a company that develops an online tax preparation program built entirely in VB.NET. I have learned a great deal (for a designer) about .NET since I started with this company 3 years ago, but aside from one week-long class I have no formal training in this area. Most of what I do consists of taking the pages built by the programmers and making them look presentable. Also a lot of un-doing of layout attempts made by my right-brained collegues.

I have spent hours upon hours tweaking the look and layout of complicated DataGrids and Repeaters. Lately, the programmers are all a-buzz about some new development tools they've got called Infragistics. From what I understand these are preformated asp.net controls or "elements" that make the programming of certain previously complicated web pages much easier. For me however, they have become a layout nightmare! It is virtually impossible for the programmers to implement them without a huge amount of horrible, ugly, non-standards compliant, layout presets. I must then try to strip out these presets and try to figure out how the code will get rendered in HTML and guess as to how to style these monsters.

If anyone has experience with a situation like this and can help me come up with a better plan, please do so. I'm using primarily Dreamweaver and Visual Studio. Thanks!

Josh

Do not conform, be transformed... Romans 12:2

Re: ASP.NET Help

Hi Josh,

I don't have direct experience with Infragistics, but we use a similar product by ComponentOne.  From what I've gathered, Infragistics is the better of the two.  Both companies create custom controls that programmers can use to handle frequently encountered situations such as paging for a datagrid.  Prepackaged functionality can largely be controlled through setting properties in Visual Studio.  A lot of people like this because it improve development speed and significantly eases the burden of creating some nice functionality, particularly if they don't know how to do it in the first place.

On the downside, these custom controls (and/or the developers who wield them) usually aren't concerned with standards.  The biggest problem I've encountered is these controls try to do everything for everyone on both the client and the server when it can't be done effectively.  They also tempt developers to place logic in the UI when it should be isolated in a business layer.  We've had issues with client script errors. 

While they can simplify paging or enable "spiffy" client-side behaviors, I regret the control we lost over our code.  Pages are often bloated and rely heavily on tables and post-backs and another layer you have to massage to play nicely with standards.  ASP.NET can be hard enough to tame on its own.  (In other words, don't look for standards on my site yet - they're on the way.)

You might be best off trying to convince your co-workers to let you write the UI.  It might save you some effort in the end.  My only other suggestion is to educate the people who decided to go with Infragistics in the first place.  As long as you're using the controls, there isn't much you can do to control the HTML they render.  If you really want to get messy, you could probably override their render methods, but that would inevitably cause client side problems because the client scripts expect certain elements, ids, etc.  (This is assuming Infragistics uses client scripts like ComponentOne).

Hope this was helpful.

Andrew

Re: ASP.NET Help

Here is my experience components for ASP.NET :

Infragistics controls are not a good solutions for almost all the reasons Andrew pointed out.  One of the most important draw backs when using Infragistics controls is they add quite a bit of weight to your pages in ViewState.  At the company I work at we switched from Infragistics to Telerik.  http://www.telerik.com/ There stuff XHTML 1.1, WCAG "Level A" or higher compliant.  Telerik also has great AJAX support.  However, most of the styling issues with ASP.NET 1.1 are fixed or improved in ASP.NET 2.0 so you can do CSS/Standards based UI's very easily. 

Here are some examples UIs of what you can do with CSS and ASP.NET 2.0:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/asp.net/refer … fault.aspx

As for learning OOP which in my opinion is the most imporant thing to learn in any kind of programming check out this site:
http://www.learnvisualstudio.net/videos/sitemap.htm  This site has tons of videos on ASP.NET 1.1 and 2.0.  The VB.NET OOP is a must for understanding OOP basics.   

Object Thinking is a good book if you enjoy reading the philosophical basis for OOP.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/073561 … oding=UTF8

Last edited by Joshua Davis (2006-01-15 19:34:38)

Re: ASP.NET Help

I feel a bit outta place commenting on this thread, since I know zilch about ASP, but I just wanted to say welcome to Josh - jhowardmace. So, welcome! smile

Give me liturgy or give me death.

Re: ASP.NET Help

Wow! Thanks for all great responses!

Andrew - Sounds like ComponentOne is very similar to Infragistics because the pages are very bloated by the time I get them. By that time, the programmers are already on the next project and telling me not to bother them. If I can get them to let me get involved sooner, it would be great, but they consider that slowing them down. Even considering that the UI layer is important is fairly foreign for most of them. Baby steps...

Joshua - I'm gonna do my best to get the programmers to at least download the trial of Telerik...at the very least it looks prettier that Infragistics. I may even try to play with it myself...Also those are some great resources you gave; most of that info is just what I need to learn. I have an entirely design background, and didn't even know what code looked like until 3 years ago...

Nathan - Thanks, and I look forward seeing you in the less "nerdy" forums! wink

Josh

Do not conform, be transformed... Romans 12:2

Re: ASP.NET Help

I'll just say "ditto" to what Joshua said about Infragistics.  I haven't used it myself, but only because I had the option to not use it.  Some of my co-workers on the other hand did not have that option, and you're just not going to get that much out of it from a design perspective.

...but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.  Joshua 24:15

Re: ASP.NET Help

Great to hear other people are using .NET and Telerik on their websites.  We are using Telerik on our admin portal for http://www.siteorganic.com.  The AJAX support is great and fairly easy to implement.  I would also have to concur with the comments that www.asp.net is the best place to go if you have deep technical questions, but I will monitor this forum and help out when I can.

Re: ASP.NET Help

www.componentart.com also has some great components (but no editor)

JD

Re: ASP.NET Help

We use ComponentArt's UI components extensively at work and they are by far the best on the market. The AJAX support is second to none, and the examples are easy to follow.

Re: ASP.NET Help

I thought I'd also mention that my good friend David offers free ASP.NET hosting to Christian businesses and individuals. David's a great guy and can also provide expert ASP.NET help to get you started. You can get more details for the free hosting at www.christianasp.net.

Re: ASP.NET Help

i am sending mail thorugh asp.net 1.1 application using class mailmessage it is going in bulk and not in inbox what should i do

Re: ASP.NET Help

If I understand the problem correctly, your app is sending email, but the receiving system (ie gmail, yahoo mail for instance) is placing your generated email into the "bulk" (ie "junk mail") folder rather than the inbox where all the non-junk-email goes.  You want to know how to stop your email from being labeled "bulk."

The best way to create automated email so that it won't be labeled "bulk" is to create it such that it doesn't look like "bulk"

1. send individual emails to individual recipients.  loop through the code rather than sending one email to fifty people
2. construct individualized email that start off Dear John Q Public, and not something generic
3. write well-formed syntactically correct sentences
4. create a meaningful subject line. don't use exclamation points
5. create a to: string that includes both the name of the person and the email address
6. don't use all caps for words or sentences.  don't use exclamation points.  don't use |33t-speak (e)lite-speak where characters are used to represent letters.

hope this helps.

Content Management with Standards In Mind: Vine Type | www.vinetype.com

Re: ASP.NET Help

*puts his name into the hat of .NET developers*

Stop voting for ANY evil, lesser evils are just that!

Re: ASP.NET Help

Hello, hope this is the right forum - since i know virtually nothing - it must be...

I have a page that I've got several ways for the user to search the database for meetings. My database is simple (and by expert standards, probably not well-formed) the entire database is 1 single table to keep it simple and it is a directory of meetings.

So far I have a method by which to search by city(dropdownlist1), by name (dropdownlist2), and by time (dropdownlist3);

I am now trying without much hope of success to create a query that the user can search for meetings by day of week.  I thought this would be simple enough and maybe it is, but I'm getting unexpected results. Each of the 7 meeting columns in the table is a bit type and in the database is a 1 or 0, but seems like in string form is a TRUE or FALSE. Having said this, the results are returned in a nice format of checked/unchecked boxes in gridview1

I am trying to tie each query to a checkboxlist collection where I just place the name and value (TRUE) in the column.  I tried doing this and tying it into the gridview "Where" clause and it seems only to work for 1 and only 1 entry - in this case [SU].  I then tried giving each day its own checkboxlist and I get similar results.  To summarize, this method only seems to work for the first value and only the first value.

My questions is, how can I get this to work so the user can check a checkboxlist and upon checking any given day, the meetings for that day are returned.  I'm 1/7 of the way there. It seems that when I use the "AND" or "OR" keywords in the WHERE clause I get unexpected results.

Here is some code that may better explain this scenerio:

And Many Thanks ahead,

Dan


[code]<asp:SqlDataSource ID="SqlDataSource1" runat="server" ConnectionString="<%$ ConnectionStrings:SUNDAY %>"

SelectCommand="SELECT [Dir_ID], [City], [Name], [Address], [State], [Zip], [County], [District], [Closed], [code], [MtgTime], [Room], [SU], [M], [TU], [W], [TH], [F], [SA] FROM [DIRECTORY] WHERE ([SU] = 1)">

<SelectParameters>

<asp:ControlParameter ControlID="CheckBoxList1" Name="SU" PropertyName="SelectedValue"

Type="Boolean" />

</SelectParameters>

</asp:SqlDataSource>[/code]